5th Feb 2007, 18:57

So you're saying the websites cited in 17:00 are, what, made up?

Please. It's obvious you people are driving cars that are poorly maintained and you simply do not care or want to notice. Had an old girlfriend like that. She refused to change the oil or do any form of maintenance on her car for fear it would "cause more harm". Guess how long her car lasted?

6th Feb 2007, 06:59

"Wow, and I know people who have BMWs that are over 300K miles?"

Wow, and I know people who have Fords, Chevies, and Dodges that went over 300,000 miles. They didn't pamper them with special Bavarian oil or imported Prussian gasoline, either. So much for your anecdotal "evidence" that fragile foreign cars are better. Sorry, but I guess I'll believe my own personal experience of routinely driving domestic vehicles well past 200,000 miles.

6th Feb 2007, 11:00

My sister-in-law was very poor and could not afford a luxurious BMW. She made do with a 1975 Ford that she drove to and from her minimum wage job at the other end of the city for 17 YEARS. The car was a gift from a relative who helped her buy it new. She could not afford expensive maintenance and often went way beyond the recommended oil change intervals. She used the cheapest oil and gas she could find. In spite of its "archaic engine design" and "cheapest construction" this humble Ford went a total of 325,000+ miles before finally being traded in (still running great). It had had a total of 3 brake jobs, a starter and belts and hoses. That's it. ZERO engine or transmission repairs...EVER. How people can say domestic vehicles are unreliable is amazing. They've very obviously never owned one.

6th Feb 2007, 11:01

This is so funny. You can post some outrageous claim and expect everyone to believe it. I post EVIDENCE from INDEPENDENT websites and I'm wrong.

6th Feb 2007, 17:56

And yet, those dozen American cars from a single typical family still exist. That is the reality. You can say whatever you want, but you can't erase the FACT of those high-mileage Chevies, Fords, and Dodges driven by a single family. It must really burn you up to be soooo wrong. I suppose protectionism is the reason why our '89 Chevy van still runs like new with 189,000 miles on it. Perhaps it was excessive spending on marketing that caused our '84 Plymouth Reliant to run to 225,000 miles before we sold it to a relative who continued driving it for years. Surely it is blind patriotism that keeps our '94 Cadillac Seville running perfectly at 170,000 miles. And what could possibly be the reason why my '85 Dodge is still running with 253,000 miles on it? Could it have simply been just well-built? No, not according to you. There must be some corporate scheme at work -- call it quality engineering.

6th Feb 2007, 19:13

Uhhh...How come these "neglected and abused" domestics with the "archaic" engines built in the "cheapest" manner ROUTINELY go 200,000 (in some cases 300,000) miles with nary a problem. It's also interesting that a HUGE NUMBER of companies use the AWESOMELY RELIABLE Ford Ranger as a company truck (and I'm SURE they don't get High-dollar gas and European oil changed by priests). Members of my family own two companies that use Rangers and Ford vans, some dating back to 1993 and all VERY reliable. And please spare us the "companies buy them because they are CHEAP" garbage. They are bought because they are RELIABLE. NO COMPANY (including the 2 my family own) are going to buy a vehicle that is unreliable. That makes ZERO business sense.

6th Feb 2007, 22:22

No, it's just isolated stories that have no relevance to the real world. If what you state was SO prevalent, it is 100% illogical that domestic makers would lose their market share as dramatically as they have. After all, there IS a reason that the imports are so dominant these days, and it's not because the domestics were paragons of quality.

So keep on posting your stories. I can find an equal number of stories about Yugos, Pintos, and other unreliable pieces of junk. Doesn't mean they apply universally.

6th Feb 2007, 23:14

Comment 17:56 makes a very valid point. There are FAR too many high-mileage domestic cars around to exist if the import crowd's assessments are even 25% accurate.

I sold a Dodge Omni in 2000 that had just over 240,000 miles on it. The car had not been taken especially good care of, had been wrecked, and used non-blessed domestic oil and whatever gas I happened to be driving by at the time it needed a fill up. In the 240,000 miles it had been driven, it had had TWO brake jobs, TWO timing belts and ONE heater hose. That's it. No other repairs. The CV joints were still in good shape, the A/C worked perfectly (and had NEVER had any more freon put in it).

In addition, after I sold the car I saw it TWO YEARS later, and the new owner STILL had not had any problem with it. It never used a drop of oil, was VERY fast, and I never even CHECKED the manual transaxle lubricant or power steering fluid the entire time I owned it. I'd love to see a BMW that can boast such great service, even with magical gas and Ph.Ds changing its oil.

Domestics are not very demanding. Even us "abusive" drivers seem to get pretty decent service from them. Of course, we are fully aware that "refined" and "sophisticated" (terms import owners love to throw about) are actually synonyms for "complicated" and "trouble-prone".

7th Feb 2007, 05:21

Yes, because it's obvious that you have never driven any of the cars about which you speak, whether you extol them or trash them. You keep posting your second-hand "evidence" and I'll keep driving my reliable American cars.

7th Feb 2007, 09:30

I've owned five BMWs, Mercedes, some American crap (and it was all crap), lots of Japanese, and two Korean cars. I was also a member of the BMW car club for many years and took their driver course on the Nurburgring. All that experience has given my the background to post what I have, and I will stand by my posts.

7th Feb 2007, 09:34

Once again, if domestics are these wundercars full of long lasting quality you'll have to explain the current state of the US auto industry.

Or is your theory that Americans are simply stupid and reject quality vehicles in favor of the "less reliable" foreign makes.

7th Feb 2007, 10:44

Talk about ludicrous state of denial! Owner accounts of high mileage vehicles from several different American brands, from different decades, from different people do NOT constitute "isolated stories that have no relevance to the real world." That is a phrase that applies to your own postings. Although imports are NOT dominant, they enjoy a certain popularity among people who don't know anything about cars because they fall for advertising hype. You continually refer to stories on the internet, but you NEVER ONCE talk about driving a real car for yourself.

7th Feb 2007, 16:07

There really ARE people who actually own and drive BMW's and Mercedes who honestly DON'T know anything about them. I'll always remember the new BMW owner who boasted to me that he loved his new 5-series because "front-wheel drive is much safer". REAL SAVVY, that guy!!