24th Jul 2010, 16:01

A comparison might be in order. The exhaust system on Fords is composed of a more than adequate number of huge, expensive component hangers consisting of metal brackets and very durable, flexible strapping that will last virtually forever and allow ample isolation from engine vibrations. Toyota (on most models) uses a very scant number of very cheap looking and flimsy little metal rods that only allow side-to-side movement, and consist of tiny little bits of metal that are roughly 20% of the size of the brackets on Ford and GM vehicles, allowing the systems to sag terribly. As a mechanic I've never found ANY component on a Toyota to be as large or solidly made as on any domestic vehicle.

25th Jul 2010, 16:32

It's pretty amazing that Toyota has such a huge following, and there are millions of cars well into the 100K's of miles range, but they are so cheaply built. I still see so many more older Toyotas than GM or Ford vehicles. If GM and Ford built them so well, how come there are so few 10-15 year old examples left driving around?

Even after the recall fiasco, which was more driven by the stupid executives at Toyota than any real quality issues, Toyotas are still more refined and better quality than any GM product ever will be. Ford is pretty much on par with Toyota, which is nice to see from a domestic company... FINALLY!

Yeah, yeah, JD powers says Ford is the best. When are we going to learn that personal experience is the real test of longevity. If you're going to go on everything the magazines and rating sources say as the word of god, then you don't really get how things work. C&D magazine still says the Honda Accord is one of the best cars ever. My personal experience puts GM wayyyyyyyy below any Toyota I have ever had. I've had ONE GM car that was good.... only one. I traded it at 61K miles though, so who really knows how much more I would have gotten out of it.

26th Jul 2010, 12:54

I don't believe that an incredibly dangerous rapid acceleration issue was stupidity, unless the issue was ignored and unheeded. I am buying another brand regardless for us.

26th Jul 2010, 15:30

Almost all the cases were found to be driver error. I wouldn't believe it if it hadn't happened to me years ago in an old Mitsubishi. I swore I was standing on the brake but the gas and brake were being pressed at the same time and the gas always wins! Luckily I got it stopped before I crashed it as I wasn't going too fast. It wasn't my car and I wasn't used to the layout of the pedals. They really should mandate that all of the cars have the same exact specs for pedals so you wouldn't have to relearn how they work every time you switch brands.

26th Jul 2010, 17:28

Before Toyota went to all electronic throttle control in Camry, the rate of unintended accelerations was 7 per 100,000 vehicles. When they went to all electronic, the rate increased to 27 per 100,000. Nothing else significant changed like pedal layout or population of people driving Camries. People who do statistical analysis of these kinds of things have concluded there is some kind of electronic fault in the Toyota throttles.

26th Jul 2010, 17:44

"Almost all the cases were found to be driver error"

Not really. A FEW were "found to be driver error" by paid investigators hired by Toyota to achieve the result Toyota was paying them to find. There are no conclusive answers in a HUGE majority of the cases being investigated (which numbers in the thousands at this point). It had already been concluded by independent lab studies that the sudden acceleration COULD have been caused by the car's computer. Now Toyota is spending the equivalent of a Camry every 33 minutes to stifle the publicity, rebuild their image and put out manipulative ads attempting to portray their cars as reliable and safe for our families. I'm not buying the ad hype OR the car!!

27th Jul 2010, 18:23

You got a lot of "could haves" in your comment. Yeah how convenient that Toyota would pay off investigators. Where did you read that? GM's quarterly report? I still think Toyota is far better than GM in any aspect of quality or performance. I am more inclined to believe it is driver error, as I see idiots on the road every day that can't even navigate their way through marginally busy streets without incident! Most of them are yakking away on their phones, so hitting the wrong pedal in an emergency situation is a very likely scenario.

27th Jul 2010, 19:22

The throttle and gas pedal system used by Toyota was sourced from a third party AMERICAN company.

28th Jul 2010, 07:05

16:32 When is the last time you saw huge numbers of 70s Toyotas on the road? I had a new 77 Celica GT and never see any like mine. They likely rusted out and went to the boneyard. I had a new 280ZX that started rusting out even having a garage. I washed and waxed them a lot. They rotted from the inside. Both of these were not cheap then. When is the last time you saw 70s Toyotas in abundance? In turn, the 70s domestics had great steel and were easily restored. If the frames go and they burn oil, I feel it's best to scrap them.

28th Jul 2010, 12:46

The 70's domestics had great steel? Oh I just had my laugh of the day. There were not too many Toyotas or Datsuns (Nissans) around back then as they were not the top sellers they are today. You don't see many of them because they weren't ever here in huge numbers. Domestic cars rusted out just as fast and usually weren't as reliable mechanically. My first car was a 6 year old Chevy that was so rotted out it was pretty much unrestorable without major frame rebuilding and complete scrapping of many of the body panels. It was only 6 years old.

28th Jul 2010, 16:24

Naming vehicles that are 40 years old really has no relevance on today's vehicles, import or domestic. And like other commentors stated, there were not very many imports being sold in the 70's compared to domestics, making a 70's import tough to find.

28th Jul 2010, 16:34

I've read through the "flimsy exhaust" comments and would like to add my experience. I saw a car today with an exhaust hanging so low it was nearly dragging the ground. That car was NOT a Camry, or even a Toyota for that matter. Nope this was a brand-new FORD TAURUS.

28th Jul 2010, 16:41

I've seen some of the hanging exhausts on Toyota's. I've also seen hanging exhausts on brand-new Buicks and Fords. But lately I've seen the REAR BUMPERS hanging off the back of Chevrolet Traverse's. I saw another one today, a brand-new Chevy traverse was driving right in front of me as we were sitting in bumper to bumper traffic, and its rear bumper was literally hanging off the back of the car and dragging the ground. It didn't look like it had been in any sort of accident or had any kind of damage done to it, you could still see the holding clips sticking out of the bumper!