29th Aug 2007, 16:28

I can ride a jeep out in the bush... but I need a capable truck in America. I have a full size domestic.

29th Aug 2007, 19:05

22:22 There's no Ford that will take abuse like a Toyota. These Ford guys think that when they haul a rowboat or 4 sheets of plywood and the truck doesn't blow up (yet), that means it's 'tough'.

Maybe Ford HAS to use a cast iron block because their engine design sucks so bad they can't make one work with aluminum. That cast iron block will never warp. Not even after the pistons, rings, heads, rods, and transmission blows up and wears out after 110,000 miles, and the Toyota with the aluminum block is still running for another 200,000 beyond that.

29th Aug 2007, 19:26

Are these Land Cruisers pulling 10,000lbs trailers as they cross Africa? Or are they just fluttering across with no load in the back? (As usual)

30th Aug 2007, 10:36

I think what it all boils down to is that there's quite a few patriotic folks on this board who are frustrated that certain Japanese automakers are making inroads on "Our turf"

As someone who grew up in a very rural area where everyone drove A: Chevy's and B: Fords and now lives in a metropolitan area where virtually 65% of all the cars are imports, I can tell you from what I'm observing that different parts of the country have vastly different vehicle preferences. By far the best selling cars in my area are Japanese cars. A close second would be European cars. If you look at that mixup, obviously reliability isn't the most pressing concern for people these days. VW's, Mercedes, and BMW have less than perfect reliability ratings. In fact, some are actually below Kia, Hyundai and all the domestic brands by a good margin. So if it isn't reliability, then why are people buying these cars?

The answer is that they are appealing. Think about it. GM produces the Chevy Cobalt, which at introduction was supposed to be a Honda Civic fighter. No way. The car is boring, bulbous looking and "econocar" in every respect. You rarely see anyone my age driving them. Meanwhile the new Civic has a much more appealing design.

Simply put, Companies like BMW, Mercedes, Honda, and Toyota (with their Scion brand) are much more on target in delivering cars that appeal to a broad consumer base. What's more important is that they appeal to people living in metropolitan, heavy population centers which are filled with young people like myself. Sure- Chevys and Buicks sell great in rural areas and to families with litters of kids and so forth, but if you're a large corporation, you need to consider all target demographics. Hence Toyota makes a boring yet reliable family sedan (Camry) and smaller, upbeat sporty cars (Scion). They're hitting the marks.

What GM and Ford need is to step away from the safety zones and start making cars that are more appealing and original. These days it is way more than just making a reliable acceptable car. You have to reach out and make cars that are extraordinary. I feel that GM in particular has come a long way. But I still see their products as being just a hair too old hat. Step up to the plate.

30th Aug 2007, 18:47

More likely you will see a Grady White on the back of my domestic. I guess you can tow a rowboat or 4 sheets of plywood... again what's your comment again on the superiority of the import aluminum engine to the strength, performance, carrying and towing performance to Ford Diesel pickups that I see in numbers every day? I see only one Tundra in the morning getting small quantities of contractor supplies/materials... one.

30th Aug 2007, 19:44

19:26 Yeah, they're 'fluttering' through 115 degree heat, jungle climates, and sand dunes that would make a Ford or Chevy overheat and lose it's transmission after about 2 hours. If you want something that might possibly get you to the grocery store on paved roads without blowing up, take your chances with a Ford. Leave the real off roading and exploring to the Toyota's. Ford 'Explorer', ha ha; 'exploring' the service garage over and over again.

31st Aug 2007, 13:48

If the mfrs. load/tow rating exceeds recommendations (Toyota Tundra) do you buy a Tundra anyway? I would not like to jeopardize lived by not following mfrs specifications seems foolhardy and a severe liability. Ford has a vehicle strong enough... I would suspect with Arizona's steady 110 degree plus heat this month each day it may certainly simulate the African plains.

1st Sep 2007, 05:55

13:48 I'm fairly sure living in Arizona and Africa are two different things. Of course there are some F-150 owners on here who probably live in Arizona, in the middle of the desert, and haul 18,000 pounds of molten lead in the beds of their trucks uphill both ways to work every day.

Let's go the other direction with the climate thing. I lived in SC, and went home to PA around Christmas last year to visit family. With the wind chill, at night, it was 20 degrees below zero. In morning, when I left, my Tacoma was the only vehicle of three that would start. My sister's Blazer, which was in the garage was frozen solid and wouldn't turn over. Neither would my brother in law's brand new Silverado. Just another example of many where a Toyota will perform under harsh conditions and the domestics won't. I let it warm up for a couple of minutes and drove it 600 miles back home. My sister traded the Blazer in for an import this past summer. Oh, and it was 6 years old and still worth about a thousand less than my 10 year old Tacoma on trade in. I wonder why that is.

2nd Sep 2007, 23:58

We really don't care about your vehicle starting in 20 degrees below zero. So what? I supposed every single domestic in a 50 mile radius wouldn't start either? My 78 Chevy starts regardless of the temperature, it just takes forever to warm up in the winter.

These exaggerations such as "your domestic transmission would fall apart in two hours" or "your domestic pulls 18,000 pounds of molten lead" just show your zealous hatred of American products, along with corny humor.

In your next comment, just answer something very simple without any of your rhetoric. Have you ever pulled 12,000 pounds with your Toyota? Have you ever hauled 1000 pounds to 4000 pounds with your Toyota's bed? Yes or No? Make all the exaggerations you want (a trillion pounds, a zillion pounds, or whatever). I have seen numerous domestics moving these numbers. Have you done this?

I don't care about Africa and I don't care about the Arctic circle. We never argued whether Toyota's were reliable or whether they'd start in the winter. No one has made that argument. The argument is, how is a Toyota a tougher structure when it has less metal in its frame? I can drop my radio remote-controlled monster truck from 10 feet in the air and not break it when it hits the ground. It's made of plastic. Is it tougher than a real-life truck, or is it lighter? Is your Tacoma tougher than a F-350, F-250, F-150, or is it lighter? For a thinner and lighter truck to be heavier duty than a heavy truck defies physics. I suppose an F-150 is tougher than a semi-truck because it's frame is smaller?

Thinner frame rails are not tougher than thicker frame rails. Thinner leaf springs cannot haul more than thicker leaf springs. Smaller control arms do not hold the front wheels on better than larger control arms.

Aluminum engines don't handle overheating better than cast-iron engines. I dare you to drain the anti-freeze and water out of your Tacoma and run the engine until it seizes and see if you can start it again. The 27 year old radiator in my C20 developed a hole in it in 2005 and I overheated the engine. It stalled and wouldn't start back up because it got so hot. I let the truck sit for 30 minutes and the engine fired right up and is still firing up in 2007. Nothing needed to be repaired, and I still haven't replaced anything on the engine with the exception of electrical components. Will you please try this before you make another comment?

If it makes you feel any better, I don't think any of us really argue whether Toyota has made reliable engines over the years. My old Honda Accord had a great aluminum engine. But just because Toyota makes reliable engines doesn't mean that Ford and Chevy don't. They can all make reliable engines without the Earth exploding, you know? Chevy 5.7 350's are incredible engines. They are extremely simple, yet very heavy duty. They are tuned like diesels so they put out peak torque at 2400 rpms. They will run with little or no problems for decades. You can pull things that go beyond the tow rating of the truck and the engine acts like it doesn't know the difference. They'll move loads idling up hills. Ford 4.2L V6 engines are very reliable engines that reach their peak torque at 3700 rpms and give you 20 miles per gallon in a 5000 pound chassis. They start right up time after time and never hesitate to give you service.

When you post your next comment, will you please tell us some Toyota engines that you think or know to be some very solid and classic tried and true engines? Please don't mention the new 5.7L, it's not been around near long enough. This way we can have a little more of a discussion, instead of an angry cat fight. This would be more effective than your "Ford's are junk" and "One Toyota will last the life of two Ford's" rhetoric.

Here's some rhetoric I could say a thousand times: "One Ford will do the work of two Toyota's".