18th Sep 2008, 19:10

I also agree that imports have become crap and not what they were. No import owner seems willing to go over to consumeraffairs.com and actually read where I am coming from. I went the other direction to domestics, only because engine problems and transmission issues on late model Japanese imports is unacceptable. I am not about to buy a larger Tundra either.

The world economy and who flies helicopters and jets around has no bearing on why I now drive new domestics. It was taking a very loyal import owner, and not having the prior level of quality as before. I went down the street and bought

2 new domestic vehicles within a 8 month period. The import dealer I had will perhaps take notice or perhaps not with our limited amount of vehicles. But maybe they will miss the dozen or more new vehicles they use to get from us over time. Quality and service is what retains customers; the import myth is over in our household. The honeymoon is over.

18th Sep 2008, 23:12

Gosh, if Camry is "setting the standard" we'll all soon be driving the new and improved Yugo.

21st Sep 2008, 00:28

I'd drive a Yugo before a Ford.

Oh, and by the way, I just looked up recent Motor Trend reviews for 07, 08, and the new '09 Camry. (The Camry was MT's car of the year in '07, '08, and easily deserves to be in '09 as well). It said, roughly quoted, that Toyota has delivered another fantastic car, it's still in the top selling spot in the United States, (has been for 11 consecutive years), followed only by the Honda Accord, and they even made a point of saying that more Camry's were sold last year than ALL Dodge cars COMBINED. I'd say that's 'setting the industry standard'. Now what were you guys saying about Ford's and Chevy's??

As mentioned above, Dodge really isn't even worth mentioning anymore, I shouldn't have wasted the words on them. I know Toyota makes the best cars on the road, and so does most everyone else, which is why we buy more of them than any other car in the country.

21st Sep 2008, 10:39

Let's see, a manufacturer that people are currently flocking to over MPG is not totally indicative of a strictly quality comment. If there's a waiting list for a Prius... is it the MPG factor or is it only because individuals that care only about quality and absolutely no need for high MPG?

I see increased sales as about high gas pricing being the true factor at the moment. Everything costs more; home expenses, electricity, heating etc. and it's tiring hearing about it's quality only, that is why people buy a vehicle like a Prius.

I am unimpressed and would rather drive a nicer vehicle, nicer ride and warranty... I bought new high end Japanese imports and the mechanical durability was lousy. I am not alone, as many on consumeraffairs.com have seen the light as well.

If you want to wait in line for a 50 MPG Hybrid, go for it... but I would keep a few grand set aside for issues. My opinion is pay a little more, get a nicer vehicle up front, and not 100% over the gas pump.

21st Sep 2008, 15:22

00:28 That's great. Did you also look up full size trucks? Anyone buying a full size truck like the topic of this review may be spending over $30K for a well equipped model. I did a lot of research and testing as well. When you are shopping for a full size, the criteria is most likely capability, load towing capability, room, handling, comfort and warranty. Since the Tundra did not have all the elements present in this price level, I bought a better GM full size.

What relevance small cars have on here baffles the imagination. If you are shopping for a larger truck and are spending more for fuel... it's likely not the same as a Camry shopper.

I have never bought a full size truck ever with a car viewpoint... maybe if it was 1 bag of mulch and a small pickup/car trunk analogy, maybe that has merit for you. As far as larger truck sales, with as great as Toyota is supposed to be... why are Tundra sales down? Should be leading the pack over the great car conclusion you have.

Maybe it's less about quality and what manufacturer has the most small fuel oriented vehicles, hybrids and otherwise, to conclude that they sell in the current depressed economy. Anyway, full size truck owners that need one are not rushing out to buy less function, less capability and certainly a far less warranty as I see it. I have had zero issues with my last 2 new domestic full size trucks.

21st Sep 2008, 23:35

"Oh, and by the way, I just looked up recent Motor Trend reviews for 07, 08, and the new '09 Camry (The Camry was MT's car of the year in '07, '08, and easily deserves to be in '09"

The Camry WAS Motor Trend's Car of the Year in 2007 due to the introduction of a V-6 that finally gave it performance comparable to domestics V-6's. However, in 2008 a domestic (The Cadillac CTS) was Car of the Year, NOT Camry. This may have been due to the numerous problems that plagued the new V-6 Camrys (and Tundras), causing Consumer Reports to drop them from their list of "recommended" vehicles.

Over half of Ford's entire line-up now carries a "recommended" listing. GM is taking on the world (and coming out on top) with the CTS, Pontiac G8 (most powerful sports sedan on the planet for under $30,000), and the Ferrari-eating Corvette. Since entering the international arena, the Corvette has boasted a 300% increase in sales outside the U.S. in the past 7 years.

22nd Sep 2008, 10:18

The Tundra has proven to be anything but reliable, has a very poor warranty (the second worst in the auto industry) and not shown any indication of having solved the problems plaguing it since its introduction.

To forego the world's best selling truck for 3 decades (the F-150) and the award-winning Silverado for one of these takes a bit of illogical reasoning.

22nd Sep 2008, 15:02

23:35 Wow. Over HALF of Ford cars carry a 'recommended' rating. I am not impressed. Take a look at the lineup of Toyota cars each year for the last ten, and see how many were recommended. Generally, every single one of them. They've only slipped up a few times. Ford considers itself lucky to have greater than half of what it makes on that list... not impressed. (And of course, it used to be much worse for them).

23rd Sep 2008, 12:04

The ironic thing about all of this, is that from what I still see, the majority of the folks out there who buy full size trucks are stereotypically what I'd call "good ole' boys" who regardless of whatever other choices exist out there will never-ever consider anything that doesn't have an American nameplate on it.

So in other words, having an argument about whether foreign cars are good or bad seems rather pointless. People who drive Toyotas are never going to convince someone who has patriotic favoritism branded into their brains that anything other than Ford or Chevy will do, even if the thing falls apart around them.

In any case, buying a full size truck, regardless of the brand or whether its " foreign" or "domestic" is financially foolhardy since we are in fact in a recession and gas prices are only going to inflate themselves even more.

I could care less if you drive a Ford or Chevy. Let's see your wallet after owning it for a few years which after then, I assume you're likely going to be selling it and quietly buy a smaller, more efficient car or truck.