27th May 2008, 10:24

Please list all these "class action suits" against Ford. We've had Fords recalled after 8 years for minor problems not related to safety. If you're going to make accusations with nothing to back them up, no one is going to pay any attention to your comments.

27th May 2008, 13:22

None of these full size truck arguments are going to matter at all since gas is now over $4.10 a gallon out here in CA.

As far as that new Chevy Silverado Hybrid? It gets 21MPG. Not exactly 'thrilling' considering that that's really only about 5MPG better than the non-hybrid. That and it costs over $40,000. At 21MPG, gas is still going to be a killer on that thing. So unless you all like cramming $150 a week into the tank to keep your "domestic" trucks going, I'd suggest considering other options instead.

As far as the rust issue goes, well this problem is actually quite rare and pertains to older Tacomas in severe environments with lots of salt. Even so, a tiny percentage of these trucks have had this frame issue. In reality, the frame failure in the older Tacomas is about the same as any other manufacture. But since Toyota has voluntarily offered to buy back any truck that has even a remote sign of frame rust, everyone in the "I hate foreign cars" camp cheers. Yet you'd never hear a peep out of GM or Ford if this ever happened. I call Toyota's callback campaign extremely honorable and smart. Keep your customers happy.

Anyhow, my Tacoma, which I use almost everyday to haul things with just passed the 220k mark with essentially no change in wear from the day I bought it. I fail to see how this is a "puny" truck.

27th May 2008, 17:11

22:52... In the event you someday ever buy a newer import, ponder this. If you suddenly had to spend over $4000 on a repair with low mileage on a relatively new import, and then have it fail again would you be so supportive? I had luck with a lot of imports, all purchased new, but they went downhill in our case. I could say I had a 1995 and it's perfect, however those days have passed... at best I would say imports are average and disposable today.

If I stopped buying in 1999, I would be on your side... but we continued and they did not hold up. No difference in driving patterns, no lack of maintenance, always garage kept... our domestics have broken that trend. Until they have a catastrophic failure with no warranty excuse like we heard before, we are not budging. Quality and great service retains business, and it has to be respected and earned. We switched... the 10 year ago banter has no credence in 2008. Comment on late model ownership with at least 40-50k on the odometer within the past 3 years. I'll be very interested to compare notes with our late model ownership experiences.

28th May 2008, 10:06

If we're going to talk generically about "domestics" or "Imports", it would be far more effective to mention brands rather than generalizations. An import can mean anything from a car built in Brazil, China, Japan, or even domestic brand vehicles "imported" to the US such as some of the newer Saturn products. If we're going to talk about Japanese brand vehicles, then you should mention actual Japanese brands. There is a huge difference between the quality of say - Mitsubishi and Toyota. If Mitsubishi, Toyota, Nissan, and Honda are all lumped together, then there's no real argument base here.

If that's the case, then simply stating that "Domestics" are better than "Imports", then all you're saying is that by virtue of region of origin, products made in one region - meaning all the brands fitting under that vast umbrella - are superior to ALL other brands made anywhere else in the world, which would make such a statement nothing more than a blatant nationalistic claim and nothing more.

By the way - my mom has a 2007 Honda CRV. Loves it. So far with 76,000 miles, not a peep of a problem and flawless performance. My Wife's 2003 Corolla has 89,000 miles and again - absolutely flawless. So I'm not sure where this new "Imports" are bad argument came from, but it isn't valid.

28th May 2008, 15:35

This review No More GM is mine. I am shocked at the debates and comments it has prompted. All I can say is having owned domestic trucks for 20 years, after this Toyota I will never own a domestic again. After 64,000 miles it finally needed front brake pads to get through inspection. That is all this truck has ever needed. I don't know how you can debate that.

28th May 2008, 17:13

17:11 Quality and service does retain great business. You're exactly right. And Ford, GM, and Dodge's lack of both have put them in the positions that they're all in today.

The fact that Toyota has grown as they have in such a relatively short time is proof of that; they have both quality and good service; the service end being a very rare thing for a Toyota owner. As I've stated many times, I've owned 3 and have never changed a part.

My domestics, all of them, proved themselves unworthy of ownership and were causing me headaches all the time. This is obviously a common occurrence, in reality.

In the statistics, new vehicles sales specifically, have shown the imports to be steadily on the rise and the domestics to be losing more and more sales. Sure, there are little ups and downs for both, but over the past decade, in general, the imports' sales have skyrocketed and on that same chart, you'd see the domestics' sales plummeting. Quality and quality service prove both.

28th May 2008, 17:17

That's a very good point 17:11, however our experience with older imports was also very bad. There's no question that they are worse now, but of the imports we owned in the 80's and early 90's, none were comparable to the domestics we owned even then, let alone since 2000.

Since 2000 we have owned 2 GM vehicles and 2 Fords. One of them is now 8 years old, and one is 6 years old this year. Neither has ever had a problem, so warranty has not been a concern for us. Nevertheless, it shows a tremendous amount of confidence in build quality when any manufacturer warrants their vehicles for 100,000 miles. It also gives us peace of mind knowing we will never have to pay for repairs, even in the very rare event that a problem should occur.

In addition, no imports (cars or trucks) that we've driven in the past 8 years have been anywhere near as smooth, quiet and comfortable as domestics. No more imports for us.

28th May 2008, 17:37

13:22 The argument is valid as irregardless of fuel pricing; a full size truck candidate will buy because of function first.

I am certain that sales statistics on many vehicles are driven over fuel. Many SUV's, large sedans etc can likely downsize and go that route. A purchaser of a full size truck needs one otherwise they would go with the little trucks. I tow and carry large loads, which over time would destroy a small truck.

The best way to review these comments is to be aware that are many applications and expectations on acquiring vehicles. You cannot put everyone in your shoes and expect them to fit all.

Full size truck owners that buy now are aware they will have to spend more to get more. If you have ever traveled overseas by the way, even 10 years ago, worldwide gas pricing has always been higher. It's now reached us.

Not everyone is going to drive small trucks, simple as that. On the higher end of the spectrum, meaning those that can afford the best quality, it makes no difference as far as fuel pricing. 40K for a great truck is not exorbitant, especially if it is fully functional. I know a high end dealership (exotics) that is unaffected by the economy, and are buying without concern over fuel or pricing. Besides having better quality in a vehicle and better warranty, you also have better quality of life. My truck enables our family to travel in one vehicle and enjoy boating on weekends. If a small truck would even remotely work as well as tow, we would have to take 2 vehicles to travel weekends... seems senseless. Again each family has their own applications.

You have to examine how the vehicles are being used and then comment. It's not always price or fuel, especially with full size truck ownership. Even this review is about an older 6 year old vehicle.