18th Nov 2008, 20:39

Well, it's also the "opinion" of the vast majority of the American public, who have made the Camry the best selling car for almost 10 years. That and the fact that the vast majority of auto publications and consumer guides also gives Toyota and Honda products higher marks in fit and finish, as well as overall reliability.

Lastly - to the guy who keeps using the consumer guide link as 'proof'... I'd suggest you take a gander at the Chevrolet section. There's your proof.

18th Nov 2008, 21:34

Look, here are the facts again. They even teach this stuff in college business and economics:

In the 70's when Toyota and Honda began to sell in the United States, it caused a lot of uproar because it was a foreign product, and MAINLY because they were BETTER products. It is an inarguable fact that the Big 3 had slipped drastically in quality because there was no competition in the market.

Toyota and Honda came in, caught on well, maybe not right away, but I don't think there's anybody out there who could argue that they've cracked the American car market; considering they're still on the TOP of every auto magazine's quality ratings, and the fact that for the last 15 years or so, the best selling cars in the U.S. have been either a Toyota or a Honda, Toyota mostly. These imports FORCED the Big 3 to improve in quality, and they have, but the fact is obvious that it was too little too late. They never caught up in quality or technology. Clearly.

If the government doesn't bail them out, GM especially, they WILL go into bankruptcy and collapse. If they'd made decent cars all along, no one would have had the motivation to buy something foreign, but again, the fact is that they didn't. Toyota and Honda stepped in and made cars that were so much better than the domestics that Americans couldn't help but notice, and buy them.

Toyota and Honda still make the best, highest quality, and most reliable cars and trucks in the world, and far better than the domestics. The 'flash in the pan' Ford Fusion is just a SINGLE example of Ford possibly (and finally) getting something right. ONE single example. Practically EVERY Toyota and Honda put into production in the last 20 years has been rated HIGHER than all domestics.

I can list 50 Toyota's for every Ford that has been rated well (and there are very few). Japanese cars are designed and built better. Period.

19th Nov 2008, 08:55

I don't know why every review has to turn into a battle of domestics vs. imports.

There are good & bad in every make.

I don't know how the commenter can draw a conclusion based on rentals though. Rentals are usually the cheapest version of every model, and they have not all had an easy life.

For what it's worth I've rented many Camrys and have come away pretty impressed.

What do I own? One import, one domestic - I love them both!

19th Nov 2008, 10:09

I totally agree with comment 12:37. My experience with Toyota has been identical. I'm not impressed with anything about them, from the rough-running engines to the jerky automatic transmissions to the puny warranty (which is only a third that of domestics).

19th Nov 2008, 14:39

Unless I see some drastic improvement, I will not buy a Tundra. It is not superior as far as ride, comfort, handling, room, bed capacity and towing as my GM.

I do not know why the import dweller keeps harping on cars and even small pickups. This is a dedicated category. They say they do not have to drive a vehicle to test them out. Seems pretty ridiculous when you are looking at full size trucks not to test 4 or 5 thoroughly.

I drive over 30,000 miles a year and tow during a lot of that. My family participates in the buying process as they spend a lot of time in my vehicles as well. Dependable and safe towing is important as well as the far superior warranty.

I will at least look at Toyota Tundra again and buy the one with the most utility, features, warranty etc. I am not driven strictly over price; the utility aspect is extremely important. A weak warranty that is gone in a year and a half in our driving is unacceptable.

My last Silverados ran 80,000 miles plus with no issues other than tires, brakes and frequent fluid changes due to heat and towing applications. And yes they were not 20 year old vehicles and complete history known as we bought them new. No doubt of neglect or delayed maintenance issues. In summary more utility, function and far superior warranty has garnered our family business.

19th Nov 2008, 15:18

The point, which you seem determined not to address, is that Toyotas are not infallible as so many people here are resolutely claiming. They are quite the opposite actually, whether you chose to admit it or not.

I do not think anybody here is trying to suggest all American cars are perfect, only much better than Toyota's in most instances. I simply do not see American cars as a whole experiencing widespread engine failures on low mileage late model vehicles like Toyota's are.

I personally know multiple Toyota owners this has happened to, one of whom is a friend of mine who I had to loan money to for a new car after it happened to them. You might not want to accept the truth, but Consumer Affairs clearly indicates that these are not isolated incidents.

Want further proof? Take a look at these reviews right here on Carsurvey as examples, EACH ONE DOCUMENTING A LOW MILEAGE ENGINE FAILURE:

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_6536.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_22516.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_21861.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_82050.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_85237.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_23139.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_23244.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_10591.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_25332.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_40999.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_33044.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_28023.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_15901.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_33248.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_73957.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_41126.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_70471.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_26098.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_37987.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_38217.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_67466.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_28054.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_107525.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_85094.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_21502.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_48643.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_49621.html

http://www.carsurvey.org/review_97335.html

I could go on, but am tired of copying and pasting these endless horror stories...

I would hate to bring the conversation down to this level, but perhaps I should be the one telling you to "deal with it..."

19th Nov 2008, 17:40

"Well, it's also the "opinion" of the vast majority of the American public, "

Oh? Domestic vehicles still count for 47% of domestic sales. The other 53% are not all buying Toyotas, or even Japanese cars. Sounds like a minority, rather than your "vast majority". I know you want it to be true, but it isn't. Sorry.