6th Jun 2008, 10:22

So are we buying a Tundra or high end Lexus? Small cars and small Tacomas are fuel efficient. Literally all small cars are selling well... domestic for and import. Since this is a full size truck review not Tacoma, Rangers etc what is the point? Small trucks do not fit any of the applications I must have... pointless to expect small cars and small trucks to meet applications. Why not discuss buses, bicycles, scooters and commuter trains for the debate on fuel pricing; it's not over quality, it's the strain on consumers... I see all manufacturers shifting to smaller fuel efficient vehicles.

Somehow the diehard import owner distorts facts. Are Land Cruisers with the V8 and the Tundras sales dramatically up lately? Don't think so. With the great quality, everyone should drive one and sell small cars and small Tacomas, and forget fuel gauges... high end import vehicles; why are their sales down now?

6th Jun 2008, 12:34

"The redesigned Tundra had an initial - yes INITIAL problem with 20,000 cams that were machined incorrectly from an American supplier - which I find somewhat ironic since these see-saw arguments seem to be heavily patriotic and nothing more."

Toyota never named the mysterious camshaft "supplier," if there even was one and we should take Toyota's word for anything. Thus, you have absolutely no basis to say where the (supposed) "supplier" was or was not located.

Furthermore, the problem was not due to incorrect machining, but was metallurgical - i.e., poor materials.

By the way, if an American manufacturer had that kind of a problem, would you be as forgiving?

6th Jun 2008, 16:36

Thank you 11:57. I've posted that several times myself.

Toyota/Lexus is still on top. Always were. Lexus has had that honor 13 years running. Since the creation of Toyota, Honda, and Nissan, the bar was raised, and the Big 3 can't compete.

7th Jun 2008, 07:09

14:16 I really liked the toaster analogy as it is absolutely dead on... when is the last time you remotely got excited to run out and buy a toaster? I cringe when I see the potato shaped uninspired styling prevalent today. I parked next to a Prius... no offense, it gets high gas mileage, but when repairs hit, and I have seen $2000 comments on repair of the electric steering lock, and who knows what the battery system will cost to repair at some point. But a toaster is a toaster; they get thrown away.

I guess I appreciate the timeless styling with many of the classic cars I have owned, and even today there is a resurgence in replicating these vehicles again. If you are content with an A to B vehicle, more power to you, but I shudder at many of the vehicles that people are currently buying to put a little fuel in and then point in somewhere.

I like opening my garage, and having intense satisfaction. Sure last month.. Aveo was up 39%... Malibu up 34%... CTS up 18%... Vibe up 65% and I prefer domestics, but honestly I do not like the direction the auto manufacturers are heading. It's all about MPG... sure a potato shape does great in a wind tunnel, but in my opinion there is more focus on how people fit inside, and then they ride around in the ugliest vehicles. It only gives one more incentive to work a lot harder and not be herded into boring bland vehicles (hence the toaster).

I hope I never lose the passion of driving, styling, performance and handling... putting a gas nozzle in and pointing a vehicle to point B somewhere seems likely over the unfortunate high price of fuel. I guess you can add a few import car options to make your toaster into a 4 slice instead of a 2 slice.... sorry not enough to remotely stir any driving passion however.

7th Jun 2008, 10:37

07:09 The 'ugly' and 'uninspired' remarks are opinion, which you're entitled to of course.

The imports are still without a doubt the better cars, and in MY opinion, much better looking and more fun to drive.

I know this is a Toyota review, but since we're on the subject of import/domestic, I just bought a Hyundai Accent, my aunt just bought an Aveo. The Hyundai looks, drives, and performs better in every way as far as I can tell. The Aveo feels like all small GM cars feel, sloppy. Like a Cavalier.

My Hyundai has more of the 'European' feel in the corners, like Honda does. And the interior in my Accent completely embarrasses the Aveo's interior.

You can reminisce about muscle cars if you like, but those days have long since been over. Nobody makes them anymore, and the Big 3's cars are as bland as any. There are cars that attempt to be like the old muscle cars, like the Charger and the new Mustang, but they aren't. Muscle cars were powerful and simple, no options, just 3 or 400 horsepower and a steering wheel.

Those days are gone. So, if you want to discuss modern cars, the best ones are made by Japanese manufacturers, as usual. Toyota, Lexus, Nissan, Infiniti, Honda. GM, Ford, and Dodge fell behind years ago and have been stumbling all over themselves trying to catch up. Not even a close race.

7th Jun 2008, 13:14

When I bought my last new car I wanted a SPORTY car. In test driving dozens of cars, only one filled the bill without bankrupting me: The Mustang. It was 5 grand less than the Camry "toaster" and is rated higher in overall build quality and reliability. If I wanted a basic appliance, I'd buy a Chevy Aveo or Ford Focus.

I DO believe we need to conserve fuel, and most of the time I drive my second car (a GM compact). Even it, however, has black-out wheels, 60-series tires, cold air induction and is bright red. I don't get excited over "toasters".

8th Jun 2008, 11:13

Well, you can call the imports 'toasters' if you like; that means nothing to me. What you can't do is say that the domestics build them better, because that is simply not the truth in any case. My import 'toaster' will outlast your GM compact and with less problems, as usual.

8th Jun 2008, 19:25

I guess my imagination is seeing new retro design 2008 Challengers... new Camaros... Mustangs...

I loved Toyotas late 60 Roadster, mid 70's Celica GT's (a direct take off on the Mustang design) and Supra Turbos, and I hope Toyota comes out with the new concept sports car.

Again why argue over a toaster... Toyota has high sales at the moment over fuel pricing, but also many complaints on reliability and mechanical issues on late models.

And the warranty quite frankly is lousy... saying the domestics have a great warranty and Toyota does not have to have a good warranty is a cop out in my opinion. If anything, they should far exceed the competition, and not have the least remote instance to even discuss after 36000 miles. Bring it in no questions asked; after all it's a Toyota right? No discussion on domestics even to comment about... have a new Toyota, it's fixed. Seems clear to me after reading how the import fan says how perfect they are.