11th Feb 2009, 11:16
I don't feel that a person can be TRULY patriotic and at the same time help bring about the destruction of an entire American industry and destroy the lives of millions of our fellow citizens. The lame arguments that there are a handful of Toyota and Honda plants in the U.S., or that Ford outsources work to Mexico has ZERO bearing on the issue.
To speak of the U.S. No longer being a "manufacturing" nation is a slap in the face to every unemployed auto worker, service tech, car salesman, parts house employee or jobber that has been put out of work by those who have no concept of patriotism. In my area we now have over 1000 new unemployed men and women seeking jobs due to dealerships closing. NONE of these people had anything to do with manufacturing, and I doubt that they will be very sympathetic to the "don't buy American" crowd.
11th Feb 2009, 13:26
Off-topic is a good description for this whole thread. Here it is: when I buy vehicles, I'm not worried about what country I'm from, what country the vehicle was made in, I'm not thinking about patriotism, flags, or anything OTHER than -- is this the best vehicle I can get for the money?? Which is why I drive Toyota's. Because they ARE, along with Honda, the best, most reliable vehicles made. Anything else is a lesser quality product.
11th Feb 2009, 15:36
I'm very confused as to how a forum where owners discuss the pros and cons of the vehicle they own, has now turned into a debate on patriotism.
I own one domestic vehicle and one import - does that make me a patriotic or unpatriotic?
I'm so confused!
11th Feb 2009, 16:37
I wonder how so called uneducated, uninformed domestic good ole boys that swill cheap beer can actually afford a new $122,000 new 2009 GM Corvette with stock supercharged 630 hp LS9 extensive usage of carbon fiber components, carbon ceramic brakes.
Sorry but advanced technology may be obvious to a 20 year basic transportation Toyota owner to grasp. So you actually tested one and are an expert on all models.
Some of us buy not based strictly on price... but a weak watered down import warranty is definitely not a plus, as is bland uninspired transportation. Drive everything first hand before making recommendations with such a broad sweep. It's highly inaccurate. A person that hates a Corolla may like a Lexus; same situation.
11th Feb 2009, 17:24
"I don't feel that a person can be TRULY patriotic and at the same time help bring about the destruction of an entire American industry and destroy the lives of millions of our fellow citizens."
Then there must not be a single innocent person in this whole country then. At one time untold millions upon millions of Americans made things in factories. I collect antique radios from the 20's-50's. If I work on one, ALL of the components (tubes, diodes, capacitors, and cabinets) are made in the USA. There were hundreds of brands of radios too, and after that, TV sets, stereos, and Hi-Fi systems. All Made in America. But one by one, companies like Zenith, RCA, Crossly, Philco, GE, Atwater Kent, and others suffered the same fate: They were done in by cheap imports or the result of those companies outsourcing their manufacturing elsewhere. The US consumer electronics industry died primarily in the 70's. They are all long-gone now, and with it the millions of jobs that put these products on American shelves. I know for fact that every single person in this country has either a TV set, a radio, or a computer. ALL of them are made somewhere besides the USA. Thus when you say that people who buy foreign wreck US jobs, then you yourself are also guilty, and so am I. We all are.
But all is not lost. We have a choice in this country, and if one loses a job in one industry, then he/she has the right and ability to change to adapt. I work in the tech industry myself and prior to that was in another industry and had to make a dramatic change in my life by getting an education and learning new things. For those millions who are losing their jobs, they have the same decisions to make as I did, and thus it is their responsibility to make that choice, not mine. Do I like the fact that manufacturing is disappearing from the US? No, not at all. But the reality is inevitable. I imagine that any day now we will be getting cheap Chinese cars, and once we do, put one more nail into the Big Three's coffins. History happens. Life goes on.
11th Feb 2009, 20:00
I think GM and Ford have never been allowed to build non-union plans on their home turf in the USA. Toyota, Honda, BMW have been allowed to build non-union plants. (Kentucky for Toyota, North Carolina for BMW.) Is this correct, or I am misinformed about that?
11th Feb 2009, 20:24
10:18 labeling a full size truck owner in a neat category may be difficult. Malcolm Forbes was a prime example on changing that viewpoint on who owns new Harley Davidsons. It crosses every segment, and you are likely to see executives, celebrities etc. now acquiring them.
Not everyone is a farmer that owns a full size truck, and even so, what's the difference? I am a boater, not near any farmland, yet own a new full size domestic truck. I see all summer long boaters with new full size domestics towing beautiful wakeboard/ski boats, even some Fountains at the ramps. I suspect they are business owners, young and older execs to enjoy this for recreation, and many of the tow vehicles are diesel Fords, Chevrolet and Dodge Rams. If you want to classify them you may be far off target.
I know individuals that own multiple new vehicles, and they have new trucks as yet another vehicle. My household has owned both import and domestics, so I cannot see any labeling applying. What I do so is taking away strictly price and searching, and buying the very best available.
I am not cruising around in an Escalade or Hummer Pickup, but I want a large list of practical applications and utility addresses or I am not buying. Test everything in your price range and then buy the new full size you like.
If someone drinks Bud or a Belgian Trapist Ale, that's the last thing I address when I am in the showroom buying another new vehicle to enjoy with my family.
11th Feb 2009, 10:18
"Last year, the average age of Toyota buyers increased by a full year. Simply put, young people don't buy Toyotas."
But they do buy Acuras, Lexus, Audis, Honda Civics, and Scions. The beer analogy is spot-on. But I'll extend it further. Let's not kid ourselves. A product is the most successful if it can appeal to a wide swath of the population. But just like beer these days, there is a distinct divide between the types of people who consumes them. If you drink Bud light, there's a pretty good chance that you're conservative, rural or perhaps living in the burbs, and middle aged. If you drive an Acura, there's probably a good chance that you're liberal, metropolitan and younger, as in 20-35 or so. Seriously - when was the last time you saw a good ole' boy driving an Acura or a yuppie driving a Ford truck? It simply doesn't happen.
I'm not picking favorites here. But perhaps this shows that the population and its demographic has changed as well as its preference for consumer goods. What's more, when shifts in demographics occur, you typically get some friction, which means those in the aforementioned groups, and particularly the shrinking group will cling more tightly to their lifestyles as a defensive measure.
Either way, companies have to adapt to these shifts. Otherwise they will fail.