4th Feb 2009, 13:09
I've read comments to that effect before, but I've never found a reporting agency that said that the ones built here were any different from the ones built in Japan. In fact, I've heard the opposite. Can you enlighten me?
4th Feb 2009, 18:32
My family has also owned a number of vehicles that were panned by the "experts" as terrible. I also don't get it, because these cars were great! Chief among them, the Plymouth Volare -- great cars.
That's why when I use the consumer reporting magazines, I look ONLY at mechanical reliability ratings. All the rest about handling, interior design, quality of interior, etc., is just the subjective opinion of somebody.
I agree with the other person --- any car other than a BMW M3 is going to be reviewed as lacking in some category. Well, a Dodge Caliber isn't a BMW, nor does it have the price tag of one. If movie and book reviews are any indication (not to mention my own experience with vehicles), I never agree with the professional reviewers. And I've never been disappointed with my choice to buck the experts' opinions.
4th Feb 2009, 23:46
I read in one of the car magazines that all the production equipment used on the Crown Vic was paid off years ago, so it is really profitable to keep making them. And there is a loyal, although small, following for it. One car magazine estimated the manufacturing cost of a Crown Vic at about $9000.
Another example of a car that was outdated long before they stopped selling it was the Oldsmobile Cutlass and for the same reason, the manufacturing cost was low. The GM product planners hated it for outdated it was and the bad impact on brand image, but every year the clever guys at the factories found ways to cut the production costs lower.
I read somewhere that what is finally going to kill off the Crown Vic is the new roll over safety standards coming in effect in a few years. Too expensive to upgrade the structure relative to the projected sales. If it weren't for that, the taxi and police car sales could keep it going much longer. I could be wrong about that though as I do not recall the source.
5th Feb 2009, 01:06
Sure! 1998 Honda Accord LX (manufactured: Sayama, Saitama, Japan), 4-cylinder, bought brand new by my sister, always maintained, only problem timing belt changes every 90K miles, 303K miles.
She bought a 1994 Accord EX-V6, brand new (manufactured: Marysville, Ohio), maintenance performed regularly. Radiator blew, 102K, control arms (112K), head gasket (130K), master cylinder (142K), 02 sensors (144K), fuel pump (149K) and again at (158K), transmission (163K), transmission (170K), Radiator (176K), slip differential (178K), car retired.
When she bought her 2009 Accord EX in Dec., she searched the dealer with a fine-toothed comb making sure to find a model with the 'J' and is loving it.
Japanese actually use quality control at their manufacturing plants there unlike the 'Japanese' plants here. Those made here are American cars with Japanese names.
5th Feb 2009, 09:22
"She bought a 1994 Accord EX-V6, brand new (manufactured: Marysville, Ohio), maintenance performed regularly. Radiator blew, 102K, control arms (112K), head gasket (130K), master cylinder (142K), 02 sensors (144K), fuel pump (149K) and again at (158K), transmission (163K), transmission (170K), Radiator (176K), slip differential (178K), car retired."
Ouch!! Sucky experience. Is there any large-scale data on this? Most comments on here are smaller-scale-based so I prefer when someone has some study or other. Anything that you're aware of?
5th Feb 2009, 23:02
Our 1990 Honda WAS built in Japan, DID have the "J" vin code and was still a total disaster. All Japanese vehicles, whether built here, in Japan, or in hollow trees by little elves, are still grossly over rated. We now drive only Ford or GM.
6th Feb 2009, 15:13
Nope, other than Sis buying a car manufactured out of the Marysville plant. She loves the '98 and drives it to work everyday.
6th Feb 2009, 16:00
"She bought a 1994 Accord EX-V6, brand new (manufactured: Marysville, Ohio), maintenance performed regularly. Radiator blew, 102K, control arms (112K), head gasket (130K), master cylinder (142K), 02 sensors (144K), fuel pump (149K) and again at (158K), transmission (163K), transmission (170K), Radiator (176K), slip differential (178K), car retired."
To me, that sounds VERY GOOD for a Honda. Ours was sold for scrap at just under 100,000 miles. Not enough space here to BEGIN to list all the problems.
6th Feb 2009, 16:32
So you had a Honda and it was a "disaster" so ALL Japanese vehicles are grossly over rated?? Using the same logic, my Chevy which was rather costly to maintain, casts aspersions on the whole American auto manufacturing sector. I still own American vehicles because I think that a few bad experiences may just be a fluke especially if reliability data runs afoul of my experience. That is also true of products from elsewhere including the dreaded Japan.
So... why aren't the Mercedes, BMW, and Audi threads packed full of the import vs. domestic argument?? Where are the half-dozen or so 100+ comment threads there?
7th Feb 2009, 10:12
Because of a few people that felt compelled to make the broad-brush statements that you decry: "All American cars are junk, and any Toyota ever made is better than any American car." That kind of statement invites an argument, and rightly so.
7th Feb 2009, 15:59
In addition to Honda, my family has also owned C-class Mercedes and 5-series BMW's. They too, were far more trouble and far more expensive to own and repair than any of our domestics.
My late father and my late brothers were avid car enthusiasts. I still am. One of my brothers, who was reasonably wealthy, had a heated and air-conditioned 4-car garage to indulge his car hobby. It was not at all uncommon for him to own 5 or 6 cars at a time. Over the years we each had brief flings with German, Japanese and numerous domestic vehicles of every shape, size and description. None of our non-domestics (including BMW or Mercedes) ever impressed us as being remotely as durable, sensible or more reliable mechanically than ANY domestic. We spent more on our few imports than we have on literally dozens of domestics over the years. That is why my wife now drives 2 domestics (1 Ford and 1 GM) and I drive two domestics (1 Ford and GM).
Since 2001 our TOTAL repair expenses on our domestics has TOTALED $10. I don't care to mess with success.
4th Feb 2009, 13:04
"Japanese cars have always gotten a free pass from them."
I agree if you're talking about their vehicle reviews. If you're referring to the repair data, you need to take up your gripe with the thousands of owners who returned surveys. Plus, if you want numbers rather than symbols, truedelta.com can give you that as well. The info is all available and the methods are reasonably transparent... so if you want to claim bias, you should call your lawyer and bring a suit, rather than taking pot-shots anonymously on this forum. Hey, I'm sure the "Big Three" would be co-plaintiffs and even pay for your representation... if you had any proof.
It's true that over time all vehicles have become so reliable that even a "much worse than average" may still only amount to a relatively small percentage of vehicles with a problem. But the claim that Japanese vehicles are just getting a "free pass" is unfounded -- even if you garner some support here on this thread.